ihmsa forums

260 Striker wrote:Another question (I'm asking for trouble here) - Sounds like the Internationals in OK were efficiently run and had a fair turn out. Did that match make money or at least break even?

Lynn,

I analyzed that match when the 2012 financials were published in the March 2013 issue of the paper. First, understand that trying to figure out the answer to your question is somewhat difficult as the International finances are mixed in with everything else and not broken out as a seperate leger. It is my belief that the Internationals have lost money for at least 5 years including the 2012 at OKC.

Steve W.

Should there be transparency in IHMSA just so all can see exactly where we are and where we need to go? It might also help if there were a presidents report more than one every two years.

I let my membership lapse years ago but still care about IHMSA and want to see it survive.

260 Striker wrote:Gosh fellas, all I suggested is having electronic score cards we could download from the IHMSA website and then later tried to see how much money that would save us. I believe in taking baby steps.

Lynn,

The reason I "enlarged the scope" of your thread is that I have been tracking finances since 2008 and have seen the trend of declining cash which has now gotten to critical status. Unfortunately, baby steps will not do the trick any longer. We are talking the need to cut $10 to $15,000 out of operating expenses. The only 3 areas that is possible is Lorene's salary, the Internationals, & the paper.

The only way we are going to get any meaningful action done is for the membership to contact their state & regional directors and demand action. Personally, given the lack of involvement in the membership with this thread, I am not holding out much hope for that!

Sorry to be blunt, but time is now of the essence and sugar coating things will not get the job done. & no apologies to those that might be offended by having to face reality.

Steve W.

I have followed and been a part of discussions such as this for quite a while. The decline, if not addressed soon, may just prove fatal. We can't sit idlely by and keep doing what we have been doing. Washington has done that and look where it has gotten us as a nation. Deperate times require drastic measures. As far a Lorenes salary, if that is removed, then someone will have to do the work she is now doing, but on a volunteer basis. If we stop printing the paper and go digital online, someone will have to volunteer do do that work, and I can assure you, it's not a 2 hour a month job to do that. Any takers???? Someone has to do the "office work" to keep us real and without the paper, in some form, we lose the heart of who we are as an organization.

That leaves us with the Internationals. In my opinion, it is the single easiest cost cutting measure we have available. If we are to be honest with ourselves, it needs to go away. If it were that important to a large segment of our membership, it would be better attended and not showing negative income. Perhaps it's time to rely on State, Regional, and East & West Championships to satisfy our "Big Match" itch. Then the cost of holding these matches falls to the individual clubs, not IHMSA.

Would I be happy to see this? No, but if we don't take proactive measures, the Internationals will go away on their own, and everything else with it.

high standard 40 wrote:In my opinion, it is the single easiest cost cutting measure we have available. If we are to be honest with ourselves, it needs to go away. If it were that important to a large segment of our membership, it would be better attended and not showing negative income. Perhaps it's time to rely on State, Regional, and East & West Championships to satisfy our "Big Match" itch. Then the cost of holding these matches falls to the individual clubs, not IHMSA.

Would I be happy to see this? No, but if we don't take proactive measures, the Internationals will go away on their own, and everything else with it.

Could not have said it better! I vote yea!

Steve W.

I vote yea. Not good but has to happen.
Mugs

Charlie's ideas have been mine as well. Regional's could and should take place of the Internationals. However, the Internationals don't have to go away. Individual clubs could volunteer to put that match on, just like clubs volunteer to put on Regionals now. In reality, the Internationals could move from region to region. Those who can afford to travel, could go, those who cannot might still have a chance to compete when that match is close to their home.

willk wrote:Charlie's ideas have been mine as well. Regional's could and should take place of the Internationals. However, the Internationals don't have to go away. Individual clubs could volunteer to put that match on, just like clubs volunteer to put on Regionals now. In reality, the Internationals could move from region to region. Those who can afford to travel, could go, those who cannot might still have a chance to compete when that match is close to their home.

Are you suggesting that the club that volunteers accept 100% of the financial responsibility including trophies, target setters, etc? If so, that means the local club will loose anywhere from $2,000 to $5,000 given the current attendance at the Internationals. I know of no club willing to accept that responsibility.

Please give us more specific information which would show the local club will at least break even.

Thanks in advance for the clarification.

Steve W.

Actually Steve, I don't have any specifics. Having been a match director, basically, Brenda Lea and I ate all the costs, with non-IHMSA members of the club wondering where their share of the "profits" were. Basically we wound up going somewhere in the red to the tune of about $500 to $1000 dollars per match. It hurt. Of course the members grousing about their not receiving any share of the profits, never showed up or lifted a finger to rebuild, care for or donate money to the care of teh range much less match costs. Without Charlie and Philip's help, we probably never could have gotten that close.

What I based my suggestion on was local clubs having the ability to put on Regional championships. Surely they are not loosing that amount of money to put on a Regional championship. If a local club was to eat the cost of the International's the costs of putting on the match would have to be scaled down to the level of say a regional event. Scaled down to the level that a local club could break even. Trophies don't have to be extensive or expensive, banquets don't have to exist. I suspect, people who come to shoot, come to shoot. The other items are just fluff. Nice but necessary?

In the end, we have to think out of the box.

willk wrote:Actually Steve, I don't have any specifics. In the end, we have to think out of the box.

Running it similar to the WCC or ECC would certainly work. We make money at the WCC & I suspect Greg does also. Unfortunately, we have had a couple of our club members retire due to age, and running a match of that size is now out of the question here. We will continue the WCC, but have figured out how to run it on one range instead of two since our number of entries is down also.

I have asked my region director to forward the link to this discussion to the board members. We will see if any chime in.

Steve W.